Game engines are not game engines.

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Game engines are not game engines.

Postby jcvw75 » Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:49 am

Took a look at Godot and Unity.

Just curious, how could anyone get used to such workflow? You have to do things, write code THEIR way.

It feels like using macromedia flash and actionscript.

There's only one way to spawn sprites. They force you to use their own scripting, in godot's case, gdscript.

I came from C/C++ or traditional gamedev background but I can't understand how these engines are supposed to attract developers like me.

I just can't stand the way these 'game engines' work. I am strictly framework person only and I am sad that game development engines have devolved to such a point to cater for this type of 'game developers'.

I am more of a libgdx person and from what I read, game developers consider libgdx to be 'hard to use'.

I dropped my jaw to read so many new or modern game developers hate coding but want to be game developers.

Have these drag/drop game engines lowered the bar for game development? What was real-skill of game coding is now being laughed off and disregarded as dinosaur way of doing things?
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Re: Game engines are not game engines.

Postby Magnesus » Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:55 pm

It's a question of getting used to the new workflow. You dislike it now because you don't know how to use it efficiently and feel bound by its limitations. The feeling will pass once you learn how to use them and get used to it's quirks and abilities - if you choose to do so.

I had this problem with modern graphic applications since I was used to Deluxe Paint on Amiga but I've been able to overcome that since then.

(Disclimer: while I use libGDX, I'm also in the "I hate coding" camp, the less code we need to write, the less bugs we make. :mrgreen: )
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Re: Game engines are not game engines.

Postby raeleus » Thu Feb 01, 2018 3:52 am

Developers go where the support and tools are. I got my training (if you can call it that) in Game Maker which is drag and drop and with integrated map editor and so on. Fun times but I'm a coder. I eventually learned Java and LibGDX is king in the Java world.

The school was trying to get us all to learn Unity, but it felt too clunky and cluttered to me. I like to make my own decisions in what tools I use or what approaches I take. I have to admit that Unity's popularity means that there is no shortage of tutorials, resources, assets, work, tools, etc. LibGDX has community made tools, but the majority are outdated, amateur, abandoned, or buggy.

I love LibGDX, but I wish there were more well supported tools other than Spine. I grow tired of rolling my own solutions. I too wish to write less code. The code I write should just be gameplay.
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Re: Game engines are not game engines.

Postby captainflyaway » Sat Apr 21, 2018 10:20 pm

I learned java is school (I still do).
What brought me to libgdx was a coding project in school.
While coding binary search trees seemed boring, I didnt know that I learned all the tools for gamedevelopement already.

Efficiently making a game will come down to game engines eventually. You can make a game in record time by drag and drop in unity. Still you are very restricted on your way of coding.

I am using libgdx because it is low level and I can code everything by hand. Its alot about the journey for me but I also think that libgdx is sometimes not advanced enough.

Ai for example could be implemented in a way that you just can use it without searching hours online on how to use given steering interfaces and forces and so on. Same goes for the A* algorithm.

If you are planning a bigger game it probably makes sense (in my opinion) to build your methods and "engine" from ground up using LinGDX to then just reuse the methods you created.

NOTE: I think many game developers using game engines like unity or ue4 call themselfes "game designer" because that really the main point of many games. The typical libgdx developer would probably call himself a "coder".
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Re: Game engines are not game engines.

Postby Magnesus » Mon Apr 23, 2018 1:04 pm

captainflyaway wrote:NOTE: I think many game developers using game engines like unity or ue4 call themselfes "game designer" because that really the main point of many games. The typical libgdx developer would probably call himself a "coder".


You an be both. We indie devs usually do too many different jobs at once and not one perfectly. :oops:
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Re: Game engines are not game engines.

Postby thaffa » Fri Jun 08, 2018 12:50 pm

I understand your frustation, but this is the new turn for game producing, this kind of "devs" made indie games more popular by doing a several bunch of games (good or not) most of it not :mrgreen: =D. So after that the game market heats up, and lot of ppl that never coded before (but have nice ideas) started to do their games, and some have profited. Ppls like games no matter what engine thier are made of, this is a fact.

I Really like libgdx coz i fell that i can make everthing on it, and give me the OOP structure so i can visualize better the gameflow about variables, objects, and what i need to do to create the mechanics. However we "lost" bunch of time coding the basics, hading to prepare assets, load assets, put on the screen, calculating positions, sizes, scales, colisions, etc etc... In game engines, is just move the asset to the folder, drag and drop to scene, rezise by moving cursor, you cand modifie colision just resing the mesh. So the game comes really fast and only few things to be worried about, but doing that you loose the OOPscope in your head.

About :
Just curious, how could anyone get used to such workflow? You have to do things, write code THEIR way.
Perhaps for team dev is a good thing because everyone share the same sistematics and vision for coding, but for individual coders like us is not too good. There are pros and cons.

Maybe if libgdx had a good scene editor that you can visualize, drag and drop assets while seeing the results, some automatic asset loading, maybe libgdx become more popular and so studios can support or patron the libgdx core devs. But adding this libgdx will be no longer a framework and became a Game Engine that you hate so much :D .
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